First off let me say this, this time I have a few simple rules-
1) No name calling
2) No spitting or hissing venom either
3) Civility is the rule of the day (if you break this one, say adios to your comment)
So I seem to have sparked a whirlwind, well you know what? Good, it's about time that we all started talking about this.
Shannan said...
"I am an idiot. I am so sorry I wrote that this situation is "your fault". It is really truly not what I meant. I actually thought about rape and being medicated later and regretted what I wrote. It was late and I speak without thinking sometimes. I am really sorry. Truly. I know that not every woman makes this decision with 100% knowledge of what she is doing. I really do know that.
What I was trying to get at, or understand, is who are you, specifically Mary, so angry at? I mean, I am sincerely trying to understand. Are you mad at me (of course you are now because I made such a hurtful comment) but I mean are you mad at adoptive moms like me? Adoptive families in general? The "system"? Or are you really just mad at the people from your past that were involved with your situation? Do you think that ALL adoptions are really bad?
I just worry because I can't go back and change the fact that I've adopted my kids...I have...whether you or anyone else likes it or not. I adopted them. I can't change that (I wouldn't want to). So all I can do now is educate myself to understand as much about it as I can to really help my kids grow up without hating me for adopting them. I mean, do you think they should hate me for adopting them? I am not being coy. I am totally sincere. Should I teach my kids that adoption sucks?
I knew when I adopted my kids there would be a lot of opposition for them growing up, but I honestly believe that we are all happier because we adopted them. But are you saying I should think and teach them that adoption is wrong? Please believe that I am being very very sincere here and not being sarcastic or confrontational at all."
First off you are not an idiot, you just said something without thinking. We all do it. I am not angry at you either. Why would I be? You spoke your mind, just as I did.
I can not say that all adoption is bad, I can't. I wish I could, but all of us know there are some women who should not be raising a child. I would prefer legal guardianship over adoption, I would prefer extended family raising a child over guardianship. I would prefer adoption be abolished all together but that isn't going to happen. Look to Australia and their laws, that is what I want in this country.
You ask me what I am so angry about? Ok, I can tell you that. No, my anger is not directed at my own situation anymore, nor is it directed at adoptive parents. I am angry at a system that in this country is so corrupt. Angry that it is allowed to go on and on, and women and children continue to be hurt. I am angry that so many refuse to listen to our voices, and even when they do listen they want to call us names and say we are wrong. The ones who do this to us would like nothing better than for us all to go away and shut the hell up. But we aren't doing that are we? Because clearly, something horrible happened to a very great many of us. When clearly those horrible things are still happening today to other mother's. When there is all this wealth in our country and it is not being used as it should be., to help mother's keep their children. I tell you again look to Australia's laws- Instead of support single mother's here are encouraged to look at adoption as an option. Why? They are stalked on the net, pregnant women not wearing rings have been stalked and handed cards at Wal Mart! Then of course there are those god awful Dear Bmom letters! It's all so crazy making.
Have you done any reading about my side of this? Have you read The Primal Wound by Nancy Verrier?(an adoptive mom btw and while I don't agree with everything she says that book made me sob for days) How about The Girls Who Went Away by Ann Fessler?
If you really want to understand what so many of us are angry about read more of our blogs. I read a lot of adoptive mom blogs, consider some of them my friends. Try reading Third Mom-she is amazing- she will also lead you to more amom blogs that are just as amazing.
Open your mind and learn. Once you start you will know what to do with your children. In the end what I want is for all of who write about the horror, the pain and anguish and loss to be listened to, and validated. Not invalidated as I was the last two days.
It's all I ask of anyone- just listen, hear our voices, I can read and control myself and listen as well. I don't want to hurt anyone, nor do I want to invalidate their feelings. It's not my thing- All this fighting and bickering accomplishes nothing. It just makes all of us look like shrieks- That's not my thing either..
I am more than happy to talk to all of you who posted- I am thankful that I got apologies. (even though I didn't think any were needed)
Jamie, I am very glad you came back- and for the record Aislin did lose a child to adoption. So she does know the pain and anguish. As I do- the first year(s) are hell on earth. I would ask you to please read Cedar's post's very carefully. She is one of my very dear friends, and has helped me a great deal in the past few years. As have a lot of the people who came here and posted in support of me. Each one a friend I made because of adoption, each helped me in my healing. I wouldn't be surprised if once you start to listen you make some new friends here.
15 comments:
Very well said my dear. I do think some good came out of this whole thing. Aside from having someone to talk to on the phone until 3 in the morning, some of us are now talking with respect. That is always a good thing.
Hi Mary, great post!
Just wanted to comment on one thing:
"I can not say that all adoption is bad, I can't. I wish I could, but all of us know there are some women who should not be raising a child."
I agree, there are women, men and couples in this world who shouldn't be raising a child, adoptive parents are not excluded from this.
However adoption is NOT the answer to this as it is a LEGAL LIE. That is all adoption really is, a legal fiction. As adoption stands today, it is about creating an alternate reality for a person that isn't real. Regardless of whether a new Birth Certifcate is created, adoption seeks to make a child the blood child of strangers and as such can NEVER be okay because lies are not okay.
If you remove this aspect of adoption, adoption itself is no more as that is its legal foothold.
What I would like to see for children who need care is a system similar to our Permanent Care system except without the aging out option. Children do need permanency and stability, they also need reality and truth; not fantasy which is what adoption is.
Not only that but because of the way adoption is practised, it has opened the doors to create the greed it causes, the heartache, the pain.
If children need to be raised by people other than who they were born and meant to be with, there should be a much bigger focus on ensuring there are real reasons for this such as preventing abuse where it is known to happen, death etc than just simply removing children from poverty stricken parents. Poor people may be poor in the eyes of physical belongings, but they still know how to feel.
Well written Mary and respectful. Thank you for discussing things many don't want to hear, its a tough job!
Hugs,
Myst xxx
I would just like to make a comment about Australian Adoptions where you say that this is the way to go. I agree and disagree on this as I am Australian and have placed a child for adoption here and now I can't have any more children due to major fertility issues and the AUSTRALIA SYSTEM SUCKS.
Now in saying this let me clarify. The good thing about the system is that when we talk to agencies about placement we are given all the options that are available from leaving off the Australian Tax Dollars and trying to bring up a baby, foster care, abortion and adoption, why because this is the law. The other good things is that due to privacy laws we are not allowed to have adoptive parents advertise for birthmothers who are looking at placing their child. There is no money changed hands with the birthmother or adoptive parents at all. Now we do get to look at profiles but we dont have any information that would actually tell us who they actually are. All due to privacy laws.
Once the child is born the birthmother can not sign any papers until 72 hours after the birth has taken place. Then the child is placed in Foster care for 30 full days. During these 30 days the birthmother can change her mind by going to the courts up until 4pm on the 30th day.
Now you are wondering what happens to the child well on the 31st day the adoptive parents are rung and told that they have a been chosen for this child and when and where they can pick it up from. Their part of the adoption is not finalised for 12 months.
Now lets talk about openness. In NSW we have what I call semi-open adoptions (even though they are called open adoptions). Why do I say this because we dont know their last names, we dont know where they live, we cant ring, email or just turn up on their door step. All communication goes through the agency and then they pass it on. In Other states in Australia (different laws in each state) they are still in closed adoptions where the child at 18 still cant find any information. So we are not all good here.
The the main reason why I hate our system is not because of the stuff above except for the closed adoptions but because we have approx 100k children who are wards of the state and are living in homes with no permanency they cant be adopted and they cant be permantly adopted either they belong to the state and most of these children have a very hard life. There are about 40k children in the normal foster program who unless their parents give up their rights or they are taken away be the courts these child too are pushed from house to house.
So Mary the Australian system is right in some ways but still in the dark ages in others. We have children who need homes but can get them.
Last year there were 276 adoptions in Australia and that included international adoptions and there are about 80k couples in the system who would like to adopt a child. For international adoptions it can take up to 10 years to get a child and then you might have aged out of the system, if you are single, gay you cant adopt and it is even hard to foster a child.
P
Oh and I just thought about another couple of things about the australian system that I like. Adoptive parents have to have fertility probelms to be able to adoptive and they must have stopped all fertility treaments prior to joinging the long list of waiting parents.
This stops the people who just want to add to their family because they have had 4 boys and want a girl or vise versa.
Also you can not do "Fundraising" for your adoption so you want see people going around saying that they can afford to have another child or a child but they just dont have 40k sitting in the bank. Well here if you dont have the 40k sitting in the bank you get no where at all.
Also all agencies are overseen by the state government and all international adoptions are only through the state agency in NSW we only have 3 agencies.
p
Respect is a very good thing~
Myst, I should have added that bit myself- And yes it is a legal lie- I have likened it to slavery in the past, and in my mind, in the US that is exactly what it is. All that money and what is really going on is the buying and selling of children- Gah- I hate it so I do!
P thank you for sharing your thoughts. I know the changes in Oz were hard won, and like anything there is good and bad in the system. But it's a starting point, a good reference point for us here-
Hi P,
Just wondering how recently you placed? Very interested in hearing more.
I am also in Australia although I lost my daughter to adoption in New Zealand and things are very different there.
I was told by an adoption worker here in NSW that open adoptins were legally enforceable... i.e. known as an adoption plan. Guess they are still lying.
P, was your decision one you wanted to make or one you felt you had no choice to make? Just curious. Thanks!
Myst
Dear Mary,
Thank you for your wonderful response. While this blog is a little hard to digest for newbies like me, I think it is crucial to understand the other side. I am going to check out the other blog and also add you to my blogroll so I can keep up with you.
There was a point in Africa where my husband and I sat in our hotel room and basically said, "What if instead of adopting this girl we just gave money to her living birthfamily to raise her?"
Sometimes it feels like if we just shared our money with them our birthmoms could have kept their babies. But I know that money does not a perfect mother make and that a lot of other things inhibited their circumstances besides money.
It does seem that there should be a better way for this in our country. A better support system. After reading some of these posts, I am beginning to think that the adoption system is looking less like a program geared to creating families and really looking more and more like a business.
Thanks for letting me lurk. I'll try to shut up now!
Hey Mary...you said to try reading Third Mom but I can't find who that is on your blog. Can you give me the link.
And aislin13...watch out..I will start stalking your blog next:)!
Shanna, here is her link http://thirdmom.blogspot.com/ I am glad you are reading. It's hard to listen to us sometimes. But it is worth the effort- Lurk all you like, and please talk! Information shared is knowledge gained! And we all know knowledge is power!
Shannan, I know I said I would post for you tonight but it has been a really crappy night. I really am just not up to doing much but playing Pet Society on my stupid facebook. I will try to get to it in the morning if the kids let me. Silly town is on a 2 hour delay because it MIGHT snow at some point so I have them for 2 extra hours in the morning. I love having them home but I am not a morning person so I wish they would just cancel everything and let us sleep in more lol
Hi Myst,
I placed nearly 18 years ago and I have been an advocate for adoption on all sides for the past 16 years and was involved in the rework of the adoption act that came into affect in 2000.
Open adoption is LEGAL and enforable in NSW it is just that what we now as the normal open adoption is what is presented as the US open system and not the NSW open system which due to the australian privacy rules it is more private. Most birthmothers after a couple of months or years depending on the degree of contact back and forth and the relationship that is developed end up swapping personal information with each other which has been the case with me for the last 10 years. Now in saying that I am lucky to get an email or letter or even photos from the once a year. But when we catch up it is like catching up with old family.
happy to talk more on the subject as I feel education is the way to go not bashing people up as there are right and wrong ways with adoption.
I was 22.5 weeks when I found out I was pregnant and when I told my parents they said that because I was now an adult (20) that it had to be my choice as to what I did and what ever I choose they would support me. As i had a friend who was adopted I research it and read many books (before internet) and asked alot of questions from many different people before I made up my mind that the best thing for my baby was adoption and I am happy to say that they are a very well adjusted 17 year old who knows their whole story and knows that they can ask me any question that they like and their is a great bond between us.
P
I believe that as long as coercion and reproductive exploitation exists, as long as Human Rights violations force mothers to surrender their babies, as long as people wanting to adopt work to convince mothers that *they* are more deserving of the mother's child than she is, as long as agencies implement 30 years of research findings on how to increase surrender rates, as long as birth records are falsified, adoption as it is currently practiced is predominantly evil. It was become a for-profit industry, and many many women pay the price.
Did you want your baby?
Did you love your baby?
What would you have need to keep your baby?
Adoption is meant for unloved and unwanted infants -- that's its social history. Given this, why did any of us who loved our babies lose our babies to adoption? That is the question we should be asking ourselves. What protections and supports did we require that were denied? What motives did others around us have?
"Open Adoption: They knew it would work"
"Adoption: Getting More Babies to Market"
"Why Adoption Is How It Is"
"Adoption Coercion in Black and White"
Thank you, Mary, for letting me post these links.
Cedar, post away! I adore you, and am so happy to have you here!
Thank you for the links, Cedar and thank you Shannan for being willing to listen to mothers who have lost their children to adoption. I know it isn't easy, but I also know it will make you a better mother (and person) in the long run.
What I do not understand is the concept that adoption is actually a positive experience for the child, rather than it being a last-resort alternative when you really NEED to save a child from death or severe abuse.
My son told me he would rather have been aborted than adopted. Many adoptees have said this in support groups. As well as stating that they consider themselves to be "nine-month abortions."
There is a collection of articles written by adoptees at
No Longer "Adopted Children," Adult Adoptees Speak Out
(link will be changing soon as the website is being re-done)
Can anyone really read these articles and still say that adoption was good for their child?
Those of us who have reunited and have had our child sobbing in our arms about the pain of the original trauma, crying unstoppably, asking why we left them, ask how any mother could knowingly or willingly subject their child to this pain.
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